(Written online - DH)
Victoria Mundy wrote:
> Sigh. Yes, but can you give me an in-the-field example of what you mean by
> logical structure and conceptual overview?
I might be able to give you example IF you'll give me a topic. We're talking
about a method.
A logical structure must be coherent, consistent with it's own givens (rules) and
it parts. it must also jive with other known systems & data. Conceptual
overview is the scope - what it takes into account (or what it leaves out).
> As I recall, this entire
> discussion started with a difference of opinion about the usefulness of
> anecdotal information vs replicated research for farmers' needs.
My point is that anecdotal information can be futher documented, if someone wants
to bother (there's really no inherent difference), and that the use it's put to
depends on the needs, time factors, etc. present. The important thing is that it
be accurate within a given context, useful, and appropriately applied.
> My expectations are my own problem, of course, but I suppose I was expecting a
> description of a field experiment or a project which in your view *has*
> logical structure and conceptual overview.
They all do.
> Tell me about an experiment you
> did or you liked, because although I am usually extremely good with abtract
> concepts, I confess to being mystified by your comments above.
Gee, that wasn't my intention. If I come up with something I'll send it on. I'm
a little pressed with other committments though and it would be easier for me to
respond to any situation you care to postulate. I guess I'm talking more about
applied science than you are.
> Whether I or anyone else likes it or not, contemporary industrialized
> science is a very valued form of knowledge in our society. We certainly
> spend an awful lot of money on it. As a teacher, I consider it my
> responsibility to help students sort out good science from shoddy science.
Start them with semantics - Give them "Language in Thought & Action" by S.I.
Hayakawa (forget about his politics).
> And if no one is willing to help me figure it out in some practical terms,
> I'm afraid I'm just going to look at all the posters hanging in the halls
> of this department and draw my conclusions from there. My favorite one is
> "Reduced saturated fatty acid levels in transgenic soybean somatic embryos
> transformed with A-mammalian delta-9 desaturase." Say that five times fast.
Paranguaricuturimicuaro. Thatīs anecdotal (excellent seedling avocados there).
> My place in sustainable agriculture is in the classroom just now. I'd like
> to do the very best by both agriculture and my students that I possibly
> can, and I very much value the help of people on this list and in other s-a
> communities.
Teach values, and back them up with science!
> Somewhat-frustrated-but-at-the-point-of-learning,
> Sincerely,
> Victoria Mundy
> Univ. of Kentucky Agronomy
Hang in there, Viki. You're doing fine.
I would like to re-emphasize even science begins and ends with defined points.
(The end is inherent to the reseach &/or thesis). Therefore, purpose and goals
(things inherently "good" to being human and working with science within a given
field) come into play.
--Douglas M. Hinds Centro para el Desarrollo Comunitario y Rural A.C. (CeDeCoR) (Center for Community and Rural Development) - (non profit) Cd. Guzman, Jalisco 49000 MEXICO U.S. Voice Mailbox: 1 630 300 0550 (e-mail linked) U.S. Fax Mailbox: 1 630 300 0555 (e-mail linked) Tel. & Fax: 011 523 412 6308 (direct - Mexico) e-mail: dmhinds@acnet.net, dhinds@ucol.mx, cedecor@acnet.net, cedecor@ipnet.com.mx
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(Written online - DH)
Victoria Mundy wrote:
Sigh. Yes, but can you give me an in-the-field example of what you mean byI might be able to give you example IF you'll give me a topic. We're talking about a method.
logical structure and conceptual overview?A logical structure must be coherent, consistent with it's own givens (rules) and it parts. it must also jive with other known systems & data. Conceptual overview is the scope - what it takes into account (or what it leaves out).
As I recall, this entireMy point is that anecdotal information can be futher documented, if someone wants to bother (there's really no inherent difference), and that the use it's put to depends on the needs, time factors, etc. present. The important thing is that it be accurate within a given context, useful, and appropriately applied.
discussion started with a difference of opinion about the usefulness of
anecdotal information vs replicated research for farmers' needs.My expectations are my own problem, of course, but I suppose I was expecting aThey all do.
description of a field experiment or a project which in your view *has*
logical structure and conceptual overview.Tell me about an experiment youGee, that wasn't my intention. If I come up with something I'll send it on. I'm a little pressed with other committments though and it would be easier for me to respond to any situation you care to postulate. I guess I'm talking more about applied science than you are.
did or you liked, because although I am usually extremely good with abtract
concepts, I confess to being mystified by your comments above.Whether I or anyone else likes it or not, contemporary industrializedStart them with semantics - Give them "Language in Thought & Action" by S.I. Hayakawa (forget about his politics).
science is a very valued form of knowledge in our society. We certainly
spend an awful lot of money on it. As a teacher, I consider it my
responsibility to help students sort out good science from shoddy science.And if no one is willing to help me figure it out in some practical terms,Paranguaricuturimicuaro. That´s anecdotal (excellent seedling avocados there).
I'm afraid I'm just going to look at all the posters hanging in the halls
of this department and draw my conclusions from there. My favorite one is
"Reduced saturated fatty acid levels in transgenic soybean somatic embryos
transformed with A-mammalian delta-9 desaturase." Say that five times fast.My place in sustainable agriculture is in the classroom just now. I'd likeTeach values, and back them up with science!
to do the very best by both agriculture and my students that I possibly
can, and I very much value the help of people on this list and in other s-a
communities.Somewhat-frustrated-but-at-the-point-of-learning,Hang in there, Viki. You're doing fine.
Sincerely,
Victoria Mundy
Univ. of Kentucky AgronomyI would like to re-emphasize even science begins and ends with defined points. (The end is inherent to the reseach &/or thesis). Therefore, purpose and goals (things inherently "good" to being human and working with science within a given field) come into play.
--
Douglas M. Hinds
Centro para el Desarrollo Comunitario y Rural A.C. (CeDeCoR)
(Center for Community and Rural Development) - (non profit)
Cd. Guzman, Jalisco 49000 MEXICO
U.S. Voice Mailbox: 1 630 300 0550 (e-mail linked)
U.S. Fax Mailbox: 1 630 300 0555 (e-mail linked)
Tel. & Fax: 011 523 412 6308 (direct - Mexico)
e-mail: dmhinds@acnet.net, dhinds@ucol.mx,
cedecor@acnet.net, cedecor@ipnet.com.mx
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